We have to follow the laws. Seriously, nobody in charge planned this. Back at the height of the St. Louis desegregation program in the 1980s, they had a term for this-- black gold. So you've got to figure out, "OK, how can I stand up for myself without proving to them that Normandy is ghetto?" The Problem We All Live With Podcast Timeline created by SFeucht. Mah'Ria, to be honest with you, she wasn't having a problem. The principal at Rihanna's middle school, not even a year into the job, resigned. That's how crowded it was. It's made up of one high school, the one that Michael Brown attended, a middle school, and five elementary schools. But even there, they were just improving the students' scores. So integration works. What happens when of a group of public school students in the Bronx goes to visit an elite private school three miles away. People tried us almost every day. She's continued to do well. Was that the first time you'd been called that word by a white person? So I had to walk out, go to the big gym. The Problem We All Live With, 1964. We went down to the jazz room, the jazz band room, and the instructor was not there. Logo Image Source: This American Life. And we said no. Kashlak’s esteemed Chief of Nephrology, Dr Joel Topf @kidney_boy walks us through the evaluation and differentiation of nephrotic syndrome and glomerulonephritis. It's easy to judge these parents, but I think part of what makes this scene so startling is that we rarely fight these battles anymore. Investigating school segregation in 2018 with Nikole Hannah-Jones: podcast & transcript. I'm Ira Glass. Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers, and may contain errors. But race barely comes up that night, except when white parents insist it is not the issue. 00:02. In an area like this one, another way of schooling might work better for all involved, but they don't have the resources or ability to change. "You can't go back to Francis Howell. The bad schools never caught up to the good schools. There was no substitute teacher. Peak of School Integration Dec 3, 1980. One of the best districts in Missouri was just five miles away. Mah'Ria usually brought home As, but when she got a C, Nedra asked the teacher why she had not been notified. She decided to stay. Music help from Damian Graf from Rob Geddis. It's confusing, I know. I think Mah'Ria and I got together and just did a swing dance of some kind. I stopped the second to last row of chairs, because I did not want to say anything anymore. In the 2013 to 2014 school year, Mah'Ria, who we heard in the first half of the show, finished eighth grade at the mostly white Francis Howell School District. Michael Brown's mother, by the way, was part of that brief 16 year window. Everybody expected that losing a quarter of the students in the Normandy District would be bad. A police officer has just killed her oldest child. So we're not talking about the Normandy School District losing their accreditation because of their buildings, or their structures, or their teachers. That night, it was a traffic jam getting there. I personally know a family in the Fox School District that was shopping for houses in our school district. And then another name gets called. Ferguson, Missouri, and the district includes the high school that Michael Brown attended. Investigating school segregation in 2018 with Nikole Hannah-Jones: podcast & transcript. Making it a little less appealing? We did find out yesterday that those student scores will become our scores. I'm no expert. This is not a race issue. But Elisa said the worksheet looked to be at the middle school level. And what she saw surprised her. But Normandy had provisional accreditation for 15 years. For me one wall in this gallery does not seem to fit in with the light hearted theme. Throughout a part of the podcast Nikole Hannah Jones and Ira Glass discuss desegregation in schools. Most black kids will not be shot by the police but many of them will go to a school like Michael Brown's. It didn't go so well. "Friend like that" meaning a white friend. CHARLES PEARSON: Yes, an entire district has never turned around. Second period was jazz band. And Cameron's an honor student. So--. After a week, you was ready to go crazy, because you're not used to nobody calling you out your name. And I would go to schools, and they would just always be trying these new things that actually sounded like they might work. I'm like, OK, I'm next. I was literally desperate to just pull my daughter out of a district that I felt failed me and my children. And at Rihanna's graduation, the vice president of the Missouri State Board of Education spoke. I didn't expect to make a friend that fast, because I remember I think it was after my third or fourth hour, I had went to lunch. He wrote in his ruling, "Every day a student attends an unaccredited school, the child could suffer harm that cannot be repaired." And just because I went to Normandy, that doesn't define who I am neither. She is going to be OK.". The conversation in the gym is taking place in one of the most segregated metropolitan areas in the country. At first, nobody knew what that meant. She almost didn't graduate on time because the school lost track of her credits. If I would be required to pay for her get a public education then I might as well try to send her to a private school. People Want to Read. Each year, the Missouri Department of Elementary and Secondary Education puts out a report that shows how each of its 520 school districts is doing. OK? It also had to pay for transportation for the students. I'm a product of busing myself. When Mah'Ria asked the school counselor about it, the counselor told Mah'Ria maybe she wasn't supposed to be there. And it's not even on the table. I still have it to this day-- Francis Howell Volleyball Camp. By law, they had no say in the matter. That's supposed to be like a warning. Mah'Ria's thriving. It's not that suddenly a switch turns on and they get intelligence or wanting the desire to learn when they're with white kids. Fourth period was precalculus taught by a retired teacher who does care and was teaching something. The job is simply too hard. They're getting worse teachers. She hadn't ridden the school bus since she was little. Exhaled. Her daughter, Mah'Ria, is a star student. How dare you. The mission-- get Mah'Ria into a better school. The back and forth just wore her down. I mean, they celebrated that the transfer students were there. That's all black children in America. This American Life Life is delivered to public radio stations by PRX, the Public Radio Exchange. Today, after years where very few communities were launching new desegregation programs, Nikole found a place that just three years ago, unintentionally, started school desegregation. "The Problem We All Live With" was a stark, muted, uncomplicated composition, and the topic! It was hard for Rihanna but she ended up having a good year. But by that point, there were hardly any white kids left to integrate with. Rewind 10 Seconds. And I had to remind myself A, B, C, D, E, F, G, H, I, J, K, L, M, N, O, P. And I'm like, my name is Pruitt-Martin. Summary. And that is how Missouri accidentally launched a school integration plan in what was an unfashionably late year for such a thing-- 2013. They don't have that effect of kids who can help boost them. Nedra, who had taken off of work to come, was watching from the side. I want to know where the metal detectors are going to be, and I want to know whether your drug sniffing dogs are going to be. WNYC Studios produces award-winning podcasts including Radiolab, Here’s the Thing with Alec Baldwin, The New Yorker Radio Hour, Science Friday, and many others. Because I felt that I needed to represent what if your kid was in a Normandy high school and they were just offered this opportunity, and other parents are saying "We don't want you here." Coming up, Adults to the Not Rescue. And there was this time when I was in middle school, there was a pool on our side of town. Altogether, it was $10.4 million that year. We're going to start an early college high school, which kids would earn college credit in high school. They were less likely to be poor. They're sending in teacher coaches from wealthier districts. But I didn't really understand until I started covering education that we were part of a desegregation program. In seventh grade, Mah'Ria was invited to a special breakfast. Last week we looked at a school district integrating by accident. Hello and welcome to The Psychology Podcast with Scott Barry Kaufman, where we explore the depths of human potential.In each episode we will talk with inspiring and thought-provoking guests who will stimulate your mind, and give you a greater understanding of yourself, others, and the world we live in. Nedra found herself pleading for an exception. In Uncategorized. And then they're getting the worst teacher. In January of 2013, just a few months after that breakfast, Normandy lost its accreditation from the state. It has never happened. I'm Ira Glass, back next week with more stories of This American Life. Rockwell's first assignment for Look magazine was an illustration of a six-year-old African-American school girl being escorted by four U.S. marshals to her first day at an all-white school in New Orleans. Maybe Michael Brown's mom knew these scores. In one month, I send my three small children to you, and I want to know is there going to be metal detectors? We are. We would have been so close to eliminating it. Keep reminding yourself that.". And we used to always go to the pool on the white side of town. She couldn't afford that. And when they graduate, they're absolutely going to be behind. But the story doesn't start with the woman. It was honestly a weight lifted off my shoulders. And the problem is that there are certain things that happen in life that we desperately want to change and we cannot. School integration, yes. You're saying well, you know from the evidence of your own life. Rev provides free full transcripts of speeches, rallies, debates, announcements, congressional hearings, events, press conferences, interviews, podcasts, and more. Typically, an entire district does not turn around. That's why a federal judge ordered white suburban schools to take thousands of black students from the city to the suburbs. I'm not you guys. The other thing about most segregated black schools, Nikole says, is that they have high concentrations of children who grew up in poverty. This was last August, almost a year ago. And its first big move was to give the district a new name. So I'm like, "I'm not going to fight you and then I get kicked out and you look like you were right.". in recent years. But if you're doing really bad, you get put on notice. They also get the worst course offerings, the least access to AP and upper level courses, the worst facilities. I went to lunch with Cameron. Live In Concert. We're going to improve teacher quality. For his part, Pearson, the superintendent, said he was shocked to read in the paper what was happening, or more accurately, what was not happening at the high school. And that's what I really began to look at. And with that, I will turn things over to Nikole. They had 40 minutes left. The problem is that because this seems to be so contagious, it means that overall, … Of course, there are poor white children in the St. Louis area, but they live in mostly middle class areas, so they aren't attending schools as terrible as Normandy's. I knew that there would be negative opinions but not that negative. The problem of death, and the paths to escape it Last week, we spoke with psychologist Sheldon Solomon about the fear of death and how it shapes our actions. She found a seat, rode the 30 miles to Francis Howell, and as the bus pulled into the school parking lot, she peered nervously through the window. And I find this one thing that really worked, that cut the achievement gap between black and white students by half. Over the last couple of months, I spent a lot of time with one of them, a Normandy mother named Nedra Martin. Or maybe she just knew her son's school didn't graduate about half of its black boys. I still have it to this day. So Nedra found herself back in her car on lunch breaks, making calls. It was great, because I never expected to have a long term friend like that. This is a 12 year old girl who is so used to the school screwing things up that she knew enough to bring proof. Then was choir, and then he had two periods of band. I was at a point of desperation. And in the midst of all that changed, we might've lost a bit of who we are. We talk with philosopher Stephen Cave about the ways we assure ourselves that death is not really the end. Meanwhile, the same year, the mostly black Normandy District that had lost its accreditation, was still operating, though barely. So she told me, and I'm like, "Oh, my Jesus. Years ago, when the MetroLink was being very popular, St. Charles County put to a vote whether or not we wanted the MetroLink to come across into our community. She chose Cameron Hensley, a driven honor student. I went to Catholic school because I had to. Support Norman Rockwell Museum and share the Legacy of Norman Rockwell's Art. This was 30 years, a full generation after Brown. Nedra saw her daughter freeze. And she was like, "That means you get to go to a different school district." Once Normandy comes in here, will that lower our accreditation? CHARLES PEARSON: Wow, what a great question. Sometimes instead of Control-Z, we actually have zero control. Posted In: Podcasts & Radio. This American Life: #563: The Problem We All Live With - Part Two August 9, 2015 7:50 PM - Subscribe Last week we looked at a school district integrating by accident. Think about that. And I want-- this is what I want. The way the transfer law works, the failing district has to pay to educate its students, even if they leave. And it was great. Well, again, it’s hard to say. It depicts Ruby Bridges on her way to her first day at an all-white elementary school. So I'm hoping that their discipline records come with them, like their health records come with them. Volume 60%. You mean just integrated schools? We are talking about violent behavior that is coming in with my first-grader, my third-grader, and my middle schooler that I'm very worried about. When I hear this, and I've written about these types of schools for a long time--. It depicts Ruby Bridges, a six-year-old African-American girl, on her way to William Frantz Elementary School, an all-white public school, on November 14, 1960, during the New Orleans school desegregation crisis. They are PCI-DSS Level 1 compliant, and recognized on the Visa Global Registry of Service Providers. MORE Charter schools, turnaround schools and small schools are all experiments that are supposed to improve schools for mostly poor, minority kids. He has a long track record in education, but until he was asked to lead Normandy he had never spent a day as the head of the school district. This American Life is produced in collaboration with WBEZ Chicago and delivered to stations by PRX The Public Radio Exchange. I'm Ira Glass. Find Ruby Bridges New Biography This is Your Time and museum quality custom giclee prints in multiple sizes, on paper or canvas, framed or unframed, with many different frame styles. Now that the district was no longer unaccredited, according to the state, the 1,000 students who had escaped now had to come back. That thing that is so effective but never discussed? Michael Brown was buried in the cemetery alongside Normandy High School's football field. St. Louis school districts finally desegregated Dec 3, 1999. And all my white friends were like, "Yeah, we're going to do it." ... Transcript. Districts get points for academic achievement, for how many students graduate, for how well they're prepared for college. Because I want to be clear. This was advanced placement. So what I would do is take later lunches on my job, go to my car, sit in my car after I've written down telephone numbers and names the night before, and I would spend my whole lunch hour calling these offices. They hadn't closed the achievement gap between black kids and white kids. There was one moment that I could not get out of my head. 4. And I had to prove her wrong. She made a list of nearby school districts and private schools. I loved it. Want to learn more about SEO, digital marketing, conversion optimization, ecommerce? And these scores are not just the scores of the specific kids who got bused into white schools. Make them ride a long distance to school every day. That's when the state made a desperation move. And my question is that, what are we doing as far as helping with the transition of these students coming into Normandy? Most Recent Podcast 4 Rhythms to Renew Your Mind. Cameron and other students finished in five minutes. We had to do better. With Stig Abell and Lucy Dallas. Don't miss an episode of Houston We Have A Problem. She thought about it again and again, but she could not get that girl who called her names out of her head. Nikole Hannah Jones is an investigative reporter, these days at The New York Times. This is the transcript for Wiggledancing! We have both-- my husband and I both have worked and lived in underprivileged areas in our jobs. Because she ain't like my presence, she wanted to fight and she called me a black B-I-T-C-H and a nigger who wasn't going to know nothing, who was stupid, and ghetto, and trashy. In the 2013 to 2014 school year, Mah'Ria, who we heard in the first half of the show, finished eighth grade at the mostly white Francis Howell School District. Or we are going to really focus on literacy. WNYC Studios produces award-winning podcasts including Radiolab, Here’s the Thing with Alec Baldwin, The New Yorker Radio Hour, Science Friday, and many others. I had come from camp, got my t-shirt and everything. My child may be the lawyer that defends your child one day. And sure, there might be a principal here or a charter school there who might do a good job improving student scores. * * * Welcome to the Making Sense podcast… This is Sam Harris. This is a commitment to education issue. And you can look at districts and schools with the same racial makeup in every urban community across the country. It really hurt. Douglas Carr was a teacher in the Normandy district. It was not going to be taking any Normandy Collaborative transfers. The Problem We All Live With has been listed as a level-5 vital article in an unknown topic. They're always talking really about the same things. They began calling kids up, one by one, to get their certificates. The surprisingly entertaining story of how the U.S. got itself into a housing crisis. But it's the one thing that we are not really talking about, and that very few places are doing anymore. Still, he sounds like any other superintendent of a struggling district. ... my podcast with TED. The year the Supreme Court handed down the Brown versus Board of Education ruling banning school segregation, St. Louis was the second largest segregated school district in the country. I knew why they did that. Now she'd be leaving. Why would we keep pushing forward when the legislature may make us close? The difference between unaccredited and non-accredited, those three letters, changed everything. We're still dealing with that today. We got tried. And I could see in her face that it was not good. It was great. So for whatever time we have, they will get a quality education. As the day ends, so does the Normandy School District, or at least--. It's the kids. White people fled the school systems and basically they resegregated the school systems by fleeing. Nikole says that her parents sent her and her sister to a school across town, which was all white, except for five black kids, which included the two of them. I don't know. That day, Mah'Ria was just the new kid in a new school, trying to make her way through her first few classes. I didn't think it would be like that. Obviously, when I'm at work these offices are open. And so today, we thought we would put it on the table and talk about it. Nikole also wrote about Normandy for ProPublica, and she wrote an incredibly memorable story about choosing a school for her own daughter for The New York Times. You asked me a minute ago why would I be doing this? And the bad schools were mostly black and Latino, the good schools mostly white. Pretty fast.". When I get off, they're closed. A few weeks after I met with Charles Pearson, a reporter from the St. Louis Post-Dispatch named Elisa Crouch spent the day following a Normandy senior to all of his classes. In the meantime, a group of parents, including Nedra, had filed a lawsuit against the state and were crossing their fingers that a judge would intervene. Mah'Ria had never had a friend who was white before. ", Yeah, I had come from camp, I think it was three days. These kids in these classes in schools of concentrated poverty don't have that. Normandy is on the border of She'd brought it just in case something like this happened. You can read that at their website, propublica.org. In addiction, neurons that are fused together in childhood will stay together in adulthood, and acted out with various addictions. So I know the routine. Ira speaks with New York Times Magazine Reporter Nikole Hannah-Jones about her years reporting And Elisa Crouch's article in St Louis Dispatch that documented the day in the life of one Normandy senior is here. Everyone's behind. This is what happened in cities all over. It was great. Summary Continued Summary Continued Mah'Ria finished eight grade in the Francis Howell school district with what Jones says "sounds like an integration fairy tale". That fall, fully one quarter of Normandy students chose the evacuation plan the law created, even though many of them would have to get on a bus at 5:00 in the morning and travel a good 30 miles away. But her own son, Michael, went to one of the most segregated districts in the state. In 2014, Michael Brown's senior year, here's how the Normandy School District was performing. (30 minutes), If you enjoyed this episode, you may like these. And it was through her that I learned the story of something that happened in this district, something that almost never happens anymore. The problem with all-stars. But integration-- before I talked to Nikole about this, I had this vague sense about integration-- maybe you had this too-- that we tried that.